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From: Gilles (gilles_at_harfang.homelinux.org)
Date: Thu 05 May 2005 - 00:09:20 BST


> >Bootstrapping Images
> >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> >The status of debootstrap and `rpmstrap' in the current utilities was
> >briefly discussed, so that vservers of lots of different types could
> >easily be built without installing extra utilities manually.
> I haven't seen this being discussed on the list, I hope I'm not about to
> say anything sacreligious, but am I in the minority to think that the
> build tools do not belong in util-vserver at all?

Although not knowing much about it, I would think so too.

Having to take care of distributions will make it more difficult to
always keep up with eventually changing policies and management tools
of those distributions.
[So that the actual version distribution in the vserver runs the risk of
being outdated...]

As I see it, the vserver is a box which looks like a system to the
enclosed software. It seems logical to me that the usual way to
install software is from _inside_ the vserver, where all the management
tools should work as if it was a standalone "real" system.

I assume that installing software from outside is more difficult (e.g.
it must be installed in non-standard locations, below "/vservers" or
"/var/lib/vservers" on Debian ...)

> [...] The job of writing/maintaining build tools belongs
> with distribution maintainers (or whoever else wants to take it up).

Maybe there could be:
- "util-vserver" providing the indispensable tools (pertaining to the
  management of the enclosure)
- "<dist>-vserver" ( la "vserver-debiantools") providing distribution
  specific utilities

As I could figure out, the second kind isn't easy either because of the
many things that must be deactivated, which are considered very important
by the management system (not knowing it is run on a "virtual" system)
[I used the "debootstrap" build-method, and many things are superfluous,
if not downright harmful (cf. klogd) inside the vserver.]

I think that an important thing is to have a way (in "<dist>-vserver")
to create a working vserver with the _bare_ minimum of software, (i.e.
just enough that it is possible to add the software which the user wants),
and of course _none_ of the parts of the system/distribution which are
"forbidden" inside a vserver.

> Am I being off my nut here? (If so, that's OK, been there before!)

I hope not. :-)

Best regards,
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